Proposed A.D.M. Training Discussion

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Proposed A.D.M. Training Discussion

Postby Bundy » Mon Oct 07, 2013 5:08 pm

EDIT: ADM= Aeronautical Decision Making vhpy

I have for some time wondered if there would be an interest and market for a structured course that pilots could attend, both practical and theoretical on this subject with specific focus on the sport of microlighting. (WCM, CCM and LSA) The idea was inspired by just a one hour session I did with an instructor over a year ago.

I would like some constructive feedback from our ATO's and Instructors on this as well as the "end users"...ordinary NPL pilots like me and you. :wink:

Poor decision making is in my opinion either the primary cause or at the very least a contributory factor in almost every aviation accident that occurs. It suggests to me at least that to address the huge GA accident rate we have, a major step forward has to be made in terms of training to combat this issue. I want to state from the outset that I do not want to interfere with the current syllabus as it is, but rather put forward a plan to address the problem by offering a course to pilots who have already qualified....and I would like to use our ARO (Misasa) as the platform to do so.

My suggestion is as follows:

1: A working group (WG) would need to be set up consisting of representatives from Misasa and specifically, any Grade A (simply because they are generally more experienced) flying instructors who would be willing to work towards developing the subject matter. What we would trying to achieve with this WG is to format the content and the course material needed to be able to teach any pilot good airmanship and ADM.

2: Once the WG has finalised their ADM and Adv Training curriculum, we would need interested Instructors throughout the country to attend a 1 day seminar so that they can be briefed on how to present the material in a two hour lecture and exam. Any Instructor who attends this Misasa Seminar will be listed then as an "approved" Instructor (for want of a better term) who will then be allowed to use the material and present a course at their ATO's...under the Misasa Banner. The reason why, is so that the course material can be standardised meaning that whether a pilot attends in the Cape or up in Gauteng, essentially the content would be the same.

3: Once this Seminar has been attended by an instructor, in order to maintain and of course add to the subject matter (keeping it "fresh" in other words), the WG can discuss and revise the material from time to time and simply mail any such changes to the already "approved" instructors. I would suggest that to remain current the instructors would not need to attend a seminar every year, but rather every 3-5?

4: The actual Course being offered to the pilot would be about a two hour lecture followed by a multiple choice questionnaire based on that lecture. If a pass is achieved (marked by the Instructor), that instructor can then mail the pilots name to Misasa and we can send him/her a Certificate of Attendence. Something nice to hang in the bar if for no other reason. puff ^

My thoughts... :wink:

Firstly, I believe that by having the majority of pilots attending such a (completely voluntary) course, we would drastically improve our safety numbers. The course would appeal and be of use to any qualified pilot, regardless of experience or aircraft type and would be specifically tailored to the sport of Microlighting.... special emphasis on recreational flying and the related dangers.

Secondly, our ATO's are literally the lifeblood of the sport. By getting something like this off the ground, in a well structured and standardised format would create an additional revenue stream to help our schools survive into the future. I believe the vast majority of pilots would support this venture if it can be provided at a reasonable cost (to attend). It honestly is something that for safety conscious pilots would never get old. I would attend such a course every 2-3 years, and I know many others who would too!
You could for example attend the lecture/exam for say R300-500 and then maybe do an hour duel which can give you a practical application of what you have just learnt? I'm sure you get where I'm going...this will be up to the WG to decide!

This will not happen overnight folks and I have not yet even suggested this to our EXCO. All I want at this stage is a discussion and your imput....especially from the instructors and ATO's who will be tasked with the content as well as the actual presentation thereof.

1: Is this a feasible plan (if not how would you do it?)
2: Would there be a market for it?
3: Is there a need (or legal obligation) to involve RAASA or can MISASA do this on our own?


Your thoughts please guys and girls... vhpy

Fire away. puff
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Re: ADM and Advanced Training Discussion

Postby bobthebuilder » Mon Oct 07, 2013 6:05 pm

What is an "ADM" and a "WG"?
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Re: ADM and Advanced Training Discussion

Postby Tumbleweed » Mon Oct 07, 2013 6:53 pm

.
Last edited by Tumbleweed on Wed Oct 16, 2013 7:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: ADM and Advanced Training Discussion

Postby John.com » Mon Oct 07, 2013 8:47 pm

bobthebuilder wrote:What is an "ADM" and a "WG"?
As I would understand it:

ADM = Aeronautical Decision Making

WG = Working Group

(^^)
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Re: ADM and Advanced Training Discussion

Postby Turbo » Mon Oct 07, 2013 9:04 pm

Education always a good thing, BUT don't make something like this prevent ATFs and likes.

What I would love is an advanced flying course, with practical exercises on extreme slow flying, prop hanging, emergency landings, extreme banks, and such that is not aerobatics. Just to gain as much feel for your aircraft as possible so that one can become 100% in touch with the hardware you trust.

Example, when flying over hoedspruit mountains for the first time, I had no idea what the limit of the plane felt like in terms of being thrown around inside the plane, hence I KAAAAKED myself.

I would like to know though so that in conditions like that (unexpected as they may be) I'm comfortable in the know that the plane is able to handle this without worrying about it getting damaged or failing in any way.

Just my two cents
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Re: ADM and Advanced Training Discussion

Postby John.com » Mon Oct 07, 2013 9:32 pm

Where does 'ATF' come from? Not sure if this was part of Alan's proposal.

As I understand this, it would be voluntary advanced training aimed at taking pilots to a level above the basic flight school training required for the NPL.

I for one really like the sound of it.

I'm just not sure what could be covered in only 2 hours!

Topics that come to mind would include:
1. Mountain Flying
2. Practical Weather Tips
3. Essential Aircraft Maintenance
4. No-Compromise Pre-Flighting

Now some of these topics would have certain pilots turning their nose up at, but for low-time pilots wanting to step up to the next level as well as identifying what they may not be doing I think that these topics could help.

Cheers, John
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Re: ADM and Advanced Training Discussion

Postby John Boucher » Mon Oct 07, 2013 11:15 pm

I like the idea.... a NPL CRM course :-)

Voluntary - YES
2 Hours - NO
Cost - minimal
1 or 2 days - YES (especially if topics such as mountain flying, weather, human performance, S&R etc is to be included)

This has absolutely nothing to do with legislation or regulation - this is for wanting to do it because it would add value to you as a pilot and your airmanship!
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Re: ADM and Advanced Training Discussion

Postby Bundy » Tue Oct 08, 2013 4:01 am

John.com wrote:
As I would understand it:

ADM = Aeronautical Decision Making

WG = Working Group
100% Correct
John Boucher wrote: This has absolutely nothing to do with legislation or regulation - this is for wanting to do it because it would add value to you as a pilot and your airmanship!
Bingo JB... :)

Guys, nowhere did I say this course should be compulsory or that it should be a legal requirement in terms of licencing or an ATF application??? That would be non sensical...there will always be pilots who are too far away to attend so I would never suggest that. I believe though that we are all within reasonable distance of an ATO....I mean how else did you do your licence? :)
It is also not about showing you slideshows of body bags and crash sites or to make you stop flying low for example... but it will give you a set of questions you must ask of yourself before you do so that you can recognise when it is safe to do so....you will be surprised how many factors are involved, and more importantly how many times you have failed to take them into account!

Do you only look at the windsock to determine which runway to use? With the wind on the nose...does it leave an EFATO option? This may change your runway choice.... :wink:

These are some of the decisions that can be the difference between landing back safely and a call to Santjie...there are 1000's more.

There is room for various course options here, both long and short depending on what the WG (working group) comes up with...Something to suit everyone's pocket must be the primary goal!

Thanks for your comment so far....more is needed. :)
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Re: ADM and Advanced Training Discussion

Postby mwjimmel » Tue Oct 08, 2013 5:17 am

Hi
Sounds great!
Count me in.

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Re: ADM and Advanced Training Discussion

Postby John.com » Tue Oct 08, 2013 5:47 am

Tumbleweed wrote:
What is an "ADM
Its up to the individual how he keeps his interest going or who or which grey beard he shares beers with in the informal hangar talk sessions.
Similarly no disrespect intended, but are you really suggesting that my advanced flying skills should be determined by what springs to grey beard's mind as we share beers in the hanger? :roll:

This here pilot would rather stake his chances on a well constructed advanced flying syllabus that is delivered by a competent and sober instructor! :shock:

Alan, the more I think of this the more I think it's got legs! The motor driving skill analogy would be attending say a BMW or Porsche advanced driving course.

As with all these things, let it be the choice of individuals as to whether they feel ole grey beard has imparted adequate knowledge! :wink:

Keep up the great work Alan! It is greatly appreciated by most. (^^)
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Re: ADM and Advanced Training Discussion

Postby bobthebuilder » Tue Oct 08, 2013 8:43 am

I like the idea of this, and would support the initiative.

The Microland guys are pretty much doing it already at their monthly braai.
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Re: ADM and Advanced Training Discussion

Postby Air Hog » Tue Oct 08, 2013 9:03 am

Dawie du Toit at Rosslyn Microflyers has been giving Practical Advance Flight training on trikes for years. The requirements were minimum 100 hours. He would have a theoretical briefing before the time and then about 2 hours practical. It made me a better trike pilot.
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Re: ADM and Advanced Training Discussion

Postby skybound® » Tue Oct 08, 2013 9:49 am

Great idea.

The downside - much like the Aero Club Safety initiative meetings - it will only be attended by those that don't 'need' it.
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Re: ADM and Advanced Training Discussion

Postby John Boucher » Tue Oct 08, 2013 10:12 am

Maybe this should be on offer when you do you "renewal" and let it become a way of life?
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Re: ADM and Advanced Training Discussion

Postby Bundy » Tue Oct 08, 2013 10:19 am

bobthebuilder wrote:I like the idea of this, and would support the initiative.

The Microland guys are pretty much doing it already at their monthly braai.
Byron yes and no... :) The "Microland Files" were started to educate...our monthly braai is for enjoying the sky followed by lots of braaivleis en K@k praat! (!!)
Air Hog wrote:Dawie du Toit at Rosslyn Microflyers has been giving Practical Advance Flight training on trikes for years. The requirements were minimum 100 hours. He would have a theoretical briefing before the time and then about 2 hours practical. It made me a better trike pilot.
Johan... this is exactly the kind of Instructor we need on board... please direct him to this thread, I would love to hear his thoughts and comments on a way forward.
skybound® wrote:Great idea.

The downside - much like the Aero Club Safety initiative meetings - it will only be attended by those that don't 'need' it.
I agree in many ways SB...but with the right kind of marketing, a professional look and system and by simple word of mouth... even the ignorant can be persuaded... How about a big badge for all attendees to pin on their flight suits? Or a Cap...etc etc.

Any fellow pilot who sees it will ask... "What's that all about?"

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