African Pilot, Aeroclub and us "thugs" (NOT)

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African Pilot, Aeroclub and us "thugs" (NOT)

Postby John Boucher » Mon Oct 29, 2012 11:45 am

At the Tedderfield Fly-In this year, we as microlighters we referred to by some reputable aviation persons as "thugs" So now, here we as a committee supported by members attending the AGM stand up for our rights and we again are branded as disruptive. Athol Franz of African Pilot went head to toe with Alan Mac on various issues and failed to see or understand our concerns. It appears that we as MISASA are being trodden on by certain persons and I post the following because I am now seriously pissed off!

The element that he refers to was fighting for you the member... so what do you want to do ... ROLL OVER AND SAY AMEN, YES SIR, PLEASE SIR???

You know what Athol... I WILL NOT BE PURCHASING AN AFRICAN PILOT MAGAZINE after this....
What happened over the past week in South African Aviation?

Aero Club of South Africa AGM
Although the AGM held at the Harvard Café at Rand Airport went off well, there was unfortunately an element from the Microlight Association that did their level best to disrupt the meeting. Despite this all the motions tabled were passed and a new board elected. Whilst Jeff Earle will remain in the chair, Paul Lastrucci remained in the vice chair position and Hanke Fourie was returned as the treasurer. Kev Storie (general manager) showed just how easy the Fundi System for membership payments was with a live demonstration of how the system works. All that is required is the cooperation of members whilst the new system’s teething problems are sorted out.

The structure of the AeCSA in South Africa is that the board is made up of ALL the chairpersons of the sections and the executive members already mentioned. Therefore it was stressed that the Aero Club belongs to its members and the board is there to serve the membership. A full report with the ambitious plans of the Aero Club will be featured in the December edition of African Pilot .
Last edited by John Boucher on Thu Nov 01, 2012 10:11 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: African Pilot, Aeroclub and us "thugs"

Postby nicow » Mon Oct 29, 2012 12:52 pm

:evil: :evil: :evil: :evil:
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Re: African Pilot, Aeroclub and us "thugs"

Postby kloot piloot » Mon Oct 29, 2012 1:02 pm

Athol says :
Kev Storie (general manager) showed just how easy the Fundi System for membership payments was with a live demonstration of how the system works.
And for a general manager to use 20 minutes to do a live demo at an AGM is unheard of. First of all, an AGM is not the place to do this and secondly with 3600 members, this demo only reached 45 attendees :shock: .

And "cooperation" asked for ... guess what ... "teething problems" ? Seriously, one year later ? :lol: :lol: :lol: .
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Re: African Pilot, Aeroclub and us "thugs"

Postby Air Hog » Mon Oct 29, 2012 1:12 pm

Well, there goes my subscription to African Pilot!
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Re: African Pilot, Aeroclub and us "thugs"

Postby hermand » Mon Oct 29, 2012 1:37 pm

Accurate reporting and unbiased journalism is a privilege!
nothing new to add.......
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Re: African Pilot, Aeroclub and us "thugs"

Postby alanmack » Mon Oct 29, 2012 2:33 pm

Microlighters is the accredited blog that MISASA supports is used for debate. This thread is under hangar talk - maybe it should be moved to MISASA I will leave it to Admin to decide.

We decided to not enter a public debate on the proceedings at the Aero Club AGM. If nothing else we succeeded - one thousand fold in getting those present to understand that we are frustrated. I have spoken to Atholl but he has opened the can and broadcast the matter of our unhappiness and now there are many that want answers. As the person that spoke on behalf of your association these are my views on a few topics.

Appointments
I fully support Jeff, Paul and Craig's appointments and remain 100% convinced that they merit their positions. The MISASA Committee heard the campaign appeal from Karl and we all voted for Paul's appointment at the previous AGM.

The Blue Sky Plan.
The Aero Club lectured us on what we must do but taken as a whole we were told to be of service to them. What we have been experiencing is now, as I see it, an official declared policy of the Aero Club. Our calls for an understanding of what the Aero Club does for our members have gone unanswered for a couple of years. Yes, we fly the flag and tell a story on our website of what is done for us but the truth is that the attitude of some of the executive and the non-visibility of the declared services mean that many are now prepared to step forward to ensure change is achieved. Oh boy, I must tell you that the "instruction" to not expect services from the Aero Club and that we must now be of service to them that was styled in line with the punch line of John Kennedy's speech was as far from a rallying call as one could get. "Don't ask what we do for you - ask what you do for us!" It sounded like the Headmaster issuing a decree! So yes, there is the matter of a future clubhouse but first, we need to get the basics right. More relevant, as far as I'm concerned, is the expectation that we must serve them and not expect services from the paid administrators of our club. If you were there, did you not feel that you must now "hand in your homework for marking?"

Below: Some excerpts that illustrate the attitude that made the original speech one of the greatest of this century and why, I believe the Blue Sky Plan needs a rewrite. Clearly there is a need for a "Blue Sky Plan" as, taken as a whole, morale is at a low ebb. "Morale or Esprit de corps" relates to our capacity to maintain belief in stated goals. In a membership association, a call to obedience will simply not do the job and issuing duties with a superior attitude will also not achieve a queue of volunteers.

Ask not what your country can do for you: This speech was delivered by John F Kennedy at his inauguration in Washington on January 20 1961.
> Let both sides explore what problems unite us instead of belabouring those problems which divide us.
> Together let us explore the stars, conquer the deserts, eradicate disease, tap the ocean depths, and encourage the arts and commerce.
> And, if a beachhead of cooperation may push back the jungle of suspicion, let both sides join in creating a new endeavour - not a new balance of power, but a new world of law - where the strong are just, and the weak secure, and the peace preserved.
> And so, my fellow Americans, ask not what your country can do for you; ask what you can do for your country.
> My fellow citizens of the world, ask not what America will do for you, but what, together, we can do for the freedom of man.

The solution actually lies in establishing a warm working relationship and positive playing field in which constructive criticism is welcomed and does not have to be taken to an AGM after more than a year of trying to be heard.

The Fundi System

Here there are two matters - the question of us retaining our own master membership database and the question of the method of collection of fee income.

I have proposed the following decisions to the MISASA Committee for consideration at the next Committee meeting. If you would like to attend please contact John Boucher for details - all our meetings are open to members and we do not hold private and confidential meetings to progress hidden agendas.

Decision 1
This is a matter of principle: That we manage our own master membership database no matter what payment system is used.
Comments
We currently do not hold the master membership list - we must own this membership database and this must not be contracted out to a third party. We are sitting on a mag and need to post it but we do not have a reliable address list - this must not be allowed to happen again.

Decision 2
Online Membership Database & Access, Inclusion etc:
Comments
> That we work with RAASA to create a draft membership database -> of past and present members ( This is well underway).
> The database must reflect static information including allergies, blood type, aircraft ownership, next of kin, active membership years etc and that a privacy policy must be enforced that the information only be used for administration of membership matters and that the information will not be provided to outside parties unless the member provides such other person with access detail to their own information.
> That we regard all past members as being "Pilot Members" even if they do not renew membership or if they join as co-pilot members.
> The membership database to include co-pilot membership for friends and or interested parties who wish to receive a copy of the magazine.
> That we include on our website a membership database that can be accessed by MEMBERS AGAINST the provision of an ID NUMBER AND PASSWORD.
> That the administrator/s have access to extract address lists and membership statistics.
> That administrator access (to the full database) be restricted to individuals so approved by the members in general meeting or by a majority of voting members on a ballot hosted on our website.
> That a member be allowed to provide access detail to others for their online membership status ( ID & PASSWORD) to be verified re proof of membership and that in addition this information is made available on an aviation (airforce type) flight "dog tag" that members may wear for use in case of an accident or incident.
> That we cause to be made the "dog tags" at our cost which are to be issued against payment of the 2013 membership fee together with the plastic "pilot" dome badge.
> That access to the draft database be granted to members and past members on our website provided that they enter their ID number and their membership number as a password which they must be required to change when they login.
> That we issue an appeal for members to confirm their details. Members must also be able to phone an appointed administration officer/s who will check and confirm their details for them.

Decision 3
Dog Tags: Free to current members. Available to past members and Co-Pilot members against payment of R50.
airforce-style_dog_tags.jpg
Decision 4
> That we employ a "friendly outgoing" person to run a MISASA Office on a one day a week basis from 8am to 1pm should suffice.
> That the person be equipped with a pay as you go cell phone, and internet access to attend to membership administration on behalf of members that have difficulty with online systems.
> That we review the decision to run our own office and payment system in the future with a view to handing over these functions to the Aero Club but only when a friendly working relationship is considered possible between the Aero Club staff and our membership. In the interim that we run a manual (not computer / internet based) accounts administration that is managed by a part-time office.

The Mag's Editorial Policy
I am told that Atholl is critical of me and the mag. Interesting as I spoke to him about an hour ago. Our mag remains a membership fun publication that is not required to stick to strict starchy publication guidelines and we will continue to accept cell phone pictures and allow members to be themselves without harsh editorial interventions to get stories to be offered in the Queen's best English. Should someone out there like to take over from me and volunteer for the Editor's job please count on my support. In the interim, the mag will continue to be produced against the benchmark of a school yearbook rather than the latest issue of the Queen's Horse & Hound!

Fly safe and please do have your say.
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Re: African Pilot, Aeroclub and us "thugs"

Postby vernon11 » Mon Oct 29, 2012 3:06 pm

The last thing we need is for Alan to be replaced as Ed. :) :)
The rest, I will have to read again and again, to absorbe it all and then to possibly comment.
Fly safe,
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Re: African Pilot, Aeroclub and us "thugs"

Postby hermand » Mon Oct 29, 2012 3:25 pm

Alan, thank you for putting the record straight.
You are doing a great job as the editor – keep it fun!
On that note I want to add an anonymous member’s comment:
THUG:
"From Hindi (thuggee)(tuggee)), from Marathi (thag, “thief”), (thak, “swindler”), from Sanskrit (sthaga, “cunning, fraudulent”), from (sthagati, “to cover, conceal”) Thuggee was an Indian network of secret fraternities who were engaged in murdering and robbing travelers and known for strangling their victims, operating from the 17th century (possibly as early as 13th century) to the 19th century. During British Imperial rule of India, many Indian words passed into common English, and in 1810 thug referred to members of these Indian gangs. The sense was adopted more generally as "ruffian, cutthroat" by 1839.
Recently the Microlighters of South Africa have, as is reported by undisclosed sources, joined this elite group of “rabble rouser” and thugs. Instead of watching rugby and drinking beer whilst disagreeing and fighting with all not supporting their team, journeyed to the Harvard Club to disrupt and disagree as a joint mob!
The golden rule for those caught out running the establishment at such a time is to stay well ahead of the rabble with the pitchforks.
On a serious note, come on, things are getting sorted out! There were no reports of any mysterious strangulations that night."
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Re: African Pilot, Aeroclub and us "thugs"

Postby Air Hog » Mon Oct 29, 2012 3:26 pm

vernon11 wrote:The last thing we need is for Alan to be replaced as Ed. :) :)

Fly safe,
Vernon.
I second this, Alan please stay.
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Re: African Pilot, Aeroclub and us "thugs"

Postby nicow » Mon Oct 29, 2012 4:16 pm

Air Hog wrote:
vernon11 wrote:The last thing we need is for Alan to be replaced as Ed. :) :)

Fly safe,
Vernon.
I second this, Alan please stay.
I agree (^^)
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Re: African Pilot, Aeroclub and us "thugs"

Postby Tumbleweed » Mon Oct 29, 2012 4:49 pm

It seems that this editor is squeezing his foot in the doors of the EEA, AAD and now Aero Club and volunteering himself as spokesman and press secretary. A bad precedent when a commercial operation serves member organisations. Where was this quote from?

I still don’t understand what the chairman and vice chairman of Aeroclub have to say regarding the biggest member’s grievances? Surely if the okes were approached outside of the meeting they would listen and commit to resolve?

If Athol Franz or whoever shouts down our representation then he is out of order.

And by the way, “MISISA DOES NOT NEED AFRICAN PILOT AT TEDDERFIELD TO MAKE IT A SUCCESS” ##
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Re: African Pilot, Aeroclub and us "thugs"

Postby Bundy » Mon Oct 29, 2012 5:07 pm

So...let me try and understand this?

As a paying member of an Association, entitled to an opinion, I must attend an AGM and the calmly and effectively nod my head and agree with what the guy behind the mic is saying? :wink:

At the end of the day we voiced our dissatisfaction, all of which could have been avoided by a more open and less beurocratic attitude from a Club that supposedly supports Recreational Aviation.

I, and a few of the EXCO are not against the Fundi system...just the way it has been implemented and "maintained". Miraculously...in the week leading up to the AGM, a lot of the gripes we have had for over 12 months all seem to be sorted out? Wow, amazing? Too little too late I'm afraid. Where was the communication during the last year??


MISASA has numerous times given our input, only to be ignored.

For achievements...MISASA was not mentioned at all...Seriously? Tedderfield was an unbelievable achievement for us as a flying community.

I get a strong sense that there is absolutely no intent from the AeCSA to work WITH the subsections towards a prosperous future. One would think that after such a clear message to the Chairman that the "flock is not happy" they would at least have called for a special meeting or discussion? When 1000 of your members are disgruntled, do you not make an urgent and visible attempt to address their concerns?...business as usual I guess at Hanger 50. More is nog n dag...

As for being labelled thugs by a well read Aviation magazine, well I lost interest a long time ago in both. :roll:

Thank you to those who made the effort to attend and see the frustration that we have had to endure for so long.
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Re: African Pilot, Aeroclub and us "thugs"

Postby Bundy » Mon Oct 29, 2012 5:19 pm

Tumbleweed wrote:I still don’t understand what the chairman and vice chairman of Aeroclub have to say regarding the biggest member’s grievances?
Neither do we TW :wink:
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Re: African Pilot, Aeroclub and us "thugs"

Postby Asterix » Mon Oct 29, 2012 5:32 pm

You see Bundy, that 1000 members are not considered to be real aviators by the snooty establishment.

Thus I maintain my "Anarchist" approach to regulations of any and all kinds. CAA to renew my: 1. Licence, and 2. ATF. Voluntary club for light sport ac and ml's, without any regulatory duty. The Snooty Click can then go to hell, and stay out of my flightpath :twisted: , I have nothing to do with them, except to irritate them from time to time, somewhere in a circuit. :wink:

(^^)

As for African Pilot - I picked up the newest copy today, had a quick glance at the sorry little halfpage dedicated to the Africa Cup, one of the main events on the ML calendar for 24 years, and put it down again. What a disappointment it was for me - I expected more....at least two full pages, (and TC in the disco ball over Graskop on the frontpage) :lol:

Mainstream aviation printed media feels f - all for microlights, that's why I don't buy ANY of them!
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Re: African Pilot, Aeroclub and us "thugs"

Postby Bugwar » Mon Oct 29, 2012 8:24 pm

Do the Aecsa speak for all their OTHER members or just for the committee?

We live in a country where we strive for equality for all but it seems in the aviation world some people will always be less equal than others.....

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